ADHD, Misinformation, and the Chaos of Online Mental Health

Margaret: [00:00:00] Hey, Preston. 

Preston: Hey, Margaret. 

Margaret: We have a very exciting episode. Is there? Do you hear a knock on the virtual door? 

Preston: Is 

Margaret: someone at the door? It is Jimmy.

Preston: Priyanka is a content creator as well as a pharmacist who works with mental health and is also a budding author, as I understand. 

Priyanka Patel: Yeah, so, yeah, 

Preston: the reason why we wanted to invite her is because her profile or her kind of, um, public images around debunking ADHD and a lot of the I think misinformation or kind of.

Sense of sensationalization of mental health and certain disorders 

Margaret: and we, I think all three of us from our different kind of corners of. Tick tock and the world and in the health professions, [00:01:00] and we know that there is in mental health and how we treat it a lot of misconceptions from a lot of different angles and some good information like out there and trying to 

Preston: contribute to those spaces, which is why if you've been on tick tock for more than 20 minutes, you've probably seen something related to mental health.

And who's to say which direction it goes. So how I kind of want to open up the conversation now is to say, as even as you've been kind of scrolling through your feed, what is some of the worst misinformation you've seen about mental health recently? And what are some things that actually were beneficial to you?

Do you 

Priyanka Patel: know what? Like, recently, I don't think I've seen anything that literally makes me want to throw my phone in the bin. And I think it's because when I'm you. I go on my for you page, I just don't engage with it. Like, I engage with the videos and content that I actually like, but I think some of the things that really annoys me on social media when it comes to mental health is kind of [00:02:00] like, I don't know if this is the right way to phrase it, but it's that like, glamorization of being depressed.

You know what I mean? And it's um, You know, depression is an awful condition, and I think people use the term very loosely at times. Um, you know, like that, and you know, trauma as well, that's also used like a lot loosely as well. So, whilst I am all for dark humor when it comes to mental health, Um, I think sometimes people Can use certain times quite loosely and be quite, um, 

Preston: yeah, 

Priyanka Patel: yeah, exactly.

Yeah. You know, um, and things like that. And then I think some of the other videos that I think really get on my nerves as well as when I see. People, like, make very short videos trying to, like, explain a condition or trying to, you know, at times even explain a medication. And sometimes it's the [00:03:00] vaguest information you will ever see.

And to me it's like, that, as someone who's watching it, Watch videos like that and then, you know, make assumptions or, or, um, you know, have them kind of think of the word, but they'll, they'll believe something about a certain condition or a certain medication or a certain experience or something because of like these really vague, um, kind of descriptions.

And sometimes they'll confuse 

Preston: their opinions for Yeah. And they present the information like this 30 second little clip. Yeah. So I don't come across this on my timeline, but people tag me in it because they're like pressing. We want you to react to this. And I'm like, I usually don't have the pin with 2, but 1 of them I came across was water fasting.

You guys heard about this 

Margaret: stuff. What the hell is that? Yes, I have heard of it. I've I've I've had someone in real life. Tell me. 

Preston: Yeah. So it's what it sounds like, which is restricting your water intake to look skinnier. And so all these people are like, Oh, if [00:04:00] you can get down to like half a liter a day or like 250 milliliters a day, then like, look at how skinny I am.

And like, really, it's just a water fast. And so all these people are like, in the comments, like, Hey, like, Hey, Kendra, I'm water fasting and I keep passing out throughout the day. Like, what should I do? And she's like, Oh, clearly you're not like drinking, eating enough garlic. And then I'm like, Oh my God, like, 

Priyanka Patel: this is 

Preston: some like, this is the misinformation, the level of like.

Almost like dangerous for people to be following. And it's, it's kind of amazing to me how there's even spaces for this stuff to live. 

Margaret: I feel like the, like, in the, I built my FYP brick by brick as the kids say, um, I don't even see these things. Similar, maybe Bianca, like, I don't even see these things on mine.

Like when there has been things, it's like, here are skinny tips. That was like a whole thing. And the like wellness space. On tiktok, I didn't even see it except for the videos reacting against it because of like the way my tiktok is so it's so interesting like [00:05:00] What are we even seeing as people who interact and create on there versus, like, what is the average experience?

Like, I have no idea what the average health information on there is. 

Priyanka Patel: Everyone's experience will obviously be very different. Like, you know, like I said, the type of videos that I see because of the type of content I engage with tend to be quite, you know, informative and, you know, Some really great content creators as well, but then on the other hand, you know, you get the complete other side, which I half the time probably won't even be aware of or, you know, we have no idea what people are actually taking in on social media these days because it's so different for everyone and that's quite scary.

Preston: Yeah, I think you Chicago did a study on ADHD actually, and they took the top 100 videos. Oh, yeah, the hashtag ADHD on them and they evaluated their quality of information. And so they found that even the ones that were made by clinicians. Had [00:06:00] misinformation in it or presented anecdote as like, clinical evidence.

And so I think if you were to throw a dart at those top 100 videos, 70 percent of them had some form of misinformation and the, the, the very informative ones are accurate ones actually performed. 

Margaret: Yeah, less 

Preston: well, unfortunately, 

Margaret: deeply. I mean, we will talk about this later as people who I don't talk about mental health online outside the podcast, uh, which Preston knows I have all sorts of complexes about why that is, uh, good and bad, but this the form of what we're doing and how we're communicating with people online.

It's like there's a dearth of, you know, mental health access in the U. S. Abroad everywhere. Basically. Yeah. And it's a really complicated, constantly evolving science and can a one minute video for a general audience, even if it's a perfectly made one with the right information, like, if someone only has a hammer to unscrew a nail 

Priyanka Patel: or 

Margaret: not now, unscrew a screw, [00:07:00] they're going to be like, let me, I have a couple of tricks that will work for it.

And it won't just because it's a general. 

Priyanka Patel: Yeah. 

Preston: I think the question is, did this one minute video, um, Add more good or more harm to the world by creating it. And that's something I struggle with a lot, too. 

Priyanka Patel: Yeah, that's why I always think sometimes when I see some of these videos and I'm, I'm just thinking, like, did this person sit there and actually think, like, are they bringing value to what, you know, to this space?

Or are they just doing this so they can post a video with a trending sound and a trending topic? So they can farm 

Preston: attention. 

Priyanka Patel: Yeah. And I think those are the videos that really get to me. And, um, Yeah, I used to engage with them, but then I was just like, you know, I can't be angry 24 7. It's affecting my sleep now, so I was like, you know what, just leave it.

Like, you know, you can't change every single one. All you can do, like, there's only so much you can control. Um, so yeah. 

Preston: Okay, so now [00:08:00] we're going to take a quick break. Thank you for entertaining us and going through the icebreaker and we have 

Margaret: an icebreaker. 

Preston: I 

Priyanka Patel: had no idea. Oh, yeah, well, we try to make it feel like we're just 

Preston: chatting.

Yeah. So. When we come back, we're going to talk about Priyanka's journey to both like her position in mental health and also like what it's like being a content creator from her perspective. 

Margaret: TikTok stardom.

Preston: So Priyanka, tell me what it was like, um, when you first started getting traction on TikTok and what inspired you to post in the first place? 

Priyanka Patel: So when I started on TikTok, it was never with the intention of wanting to kind of go into creating content and building up a social media following. I was literally, initially, I was just posting videos of like funny moments of my family.

Like there was one video that actually went quite viral of when we played the credit card game. No matter how many times I [00:09:00] watch it, I'd literally, I'm like, wheeze laughing at my dad. So those are just like, 

Preston: you're like, you like hit your head against the door to stop the credit card. He was taking it so 

Priyanka Patel: seriously, like it was the funniest thing ever.

Um, and then I think the reason why I started actually going on TikTok and talking about all of this is because that's how my journey started. And I still remember it to this day when I was on TikTok and it was, it was a girl and she was on a desk. And she was facing the camera and there was kind of, um, unknown and unrecognized symptoms of ADHD in women that she was listing on the screen.

And that was the first time I'd come across it. And this is a pharmacist, a mental health pharmacist talking. And that was the first time that I had really come across, oh wait, ADHD can be in adults and women? And that really got me thinking because I was like, not only do I relate to this stuff, like this is such a new phenomenon.

I've never heard of anything like this. You know, we always have that assumption and [00:10:00] stereotype that thank God we're starting to break away from, that ADHD is a child's thing. And because I resonated really like strongly with that, I then did, like, really, really deep dive research. So, coming from a clinical background, you know what resources to use.

Um, I had good, uh, relationships with, you know, actual psychiatrists that I worked with. So, you know, I would ask them questions because, you know, I'm very, I overshare way too much as it is. So, I, I didn't care. I was like, I'll tell you all about, like, my childhood. And, um, so yeah, it was, um, I was just told to try this antidepressant.

Why don't you try this? Try CBT. Oh my god, I hated CBT. I had this old lady phone me up every two weeks. telling me, have you done your journal? Have you done your, your thought journal? And I'm like, that is not going to help. And it just did my head in like, it works for some people, but for me, like I told them so many times that this is not going to help me.

I mean, one time she even, [00:11:00] when I was like, Oh, I can't get out of bed. Like I was really depressed. And I was like, I really can't get out of bed. And her advice was for me to dress up. Like I was going to go visit my grandma. And I was like, I don't know what that means. Like, I don't know what that means. And, um, I didn't try that because I didn't understand it.

So your problem is you 

Preston: couldn't get out of bed and her solution was to get out of bed and get dressed. 

Priyanka Patel: Exactly. So I was trying to knock 

Preston: it 

Margaret: off, 

Priyanka Patel: famously 

Margaret: affected 

Priyanka Patel: to get out of bed in the first place. I don't understand how that works, but yeah, anyway. Um, so yeah, I've been kind of like ping ponged, um, all over when it comes to all of this stuff.

And then, yeah, so, um. I think it was after, um, I was on Sertraline for a while and yes, I felt better, but, and I think from other people I've spoken to who have also, like, in that stage of, like, pre ADHD diagnosis and kind of being on an antidepressant have said they felt something is missing, like [00:12:00] something's not quite right.

So that's what, what that felt like. So, um, And that's when I was, like, getting really frustrated with some of these GPs. And the fact that, you know, I even said to them, Look, you know, I'm a pharmacist. I work in the clinical field. Like, this is no way to kind of dismiss someone who isn't a clinician. But the fact that even someone in the clinical field wasn't being listened to, I think, was just quite shocking.

Um, You know, I was even there throwing guidance at them and everything, and I was like, look, I've got the, you know, the symptom profile here. I've even like, ticked it and printed it out for you and everything. But yeah, and then finally, um, it took me literally kicking and screaming, and I went into the GPs because I was, I was at my wits end.

This, what led me to kind of, it was, I, so I was working for private mental health hospitals at this point, and I don't know if you guys have, um, similar type of establishment, if you've, and it's kind of, yeah, it's kind of like a prison and those 

Margaret: ones are like prisons for us, but we do have, like, for [00:13:00] profit, I guess, institutions and then non, whatever complicated, but yes, function, I think, probably similar.

Priyanka Patel: Yeah. So, um, these hospitals I was working in, they were basically, um, People who were under, um, the criminal justice system, but they were too mentally unwell to be in, um, a normal hospital and to, and in a normal prison because they needed mental health care. So similar 

Preston: to like our state hospitals, I would say.

Margaret: Yeah, that's like our, our private hospitals are like the fanciest ones. 

Priyanka Patel: Oh, no, yeah, no, no, no. There's um, I mean, some of them were quite like nice looking, but no. I thought, I thought But you were working 

Margaret: in that setting. 

Priyanka Patel: Yeah. So, um, with these ones, it was like a really like insane, um, kind of environment.

Like you have like this huge fat pack of keys and you have to have codes everywhere and you have to close this door and then wait in the air. Oh my God, the airlock, you know, you have to wait for that slow door just to close. And then you've got to listen out for the click and then only can you have [00:14:00] the, oh my God, it was just a nightmare.

Preston: So a lot of executive function was necessary. 

Priyanka Patel: Oh, trust me. 

Preston: the hospital. 

Priyanka Patel: It would take me like up to an hour just to get into the ward at times because I would get lost. I would forget the code. I would forget my pass. It was just a nightmare. And then I actually accidentally walked off with a set of keys and I didn't realize.

So I'd driven to my friends, um, in a different city that was about two hours away. And the next morning, I see like 30 missed calls off my phone from the hospital. Um, and then I bring them back and they're just like, Please tell us you, you have these keys because they do a check every night. And basically, if they can't find a set of keys, they enter the hospital in lockdown.

And no one can leave until they locate it or completely change all the locks. So I was like, yes, I do, do have the keys. So they were like, okay, thank God, you need to bring them back. And I was like, I'm two hours away. It's a Saturday. Um, And it was that serious that they ended up having to send someone to drive two hours to me to come get them.

Oh wow. And then, yeah, so I got [00:15:00] into quite a bit of trouble. I had to go through security training and basically That's like the highest stakes, 

Margaret: like, talk about, like, ADHD, like, yeah, losing things, like losing your keys, but that's like that situation. 

Priyanka Patel: Exactly. On like, 

Margaret: high intensity. 

Priyanka Patel: Honestly, like, it was so embarrassing, and then I had to be chauffeured around.

I wasn't allowed keys for like a month, and so I had this, um, so each time I had to have someone chauffeur around, then I had to ring the reception and get someone to come get me, and I was just like, oh my god, and then I had to do security training all over again, so, you know. It caused a lot of 

Margaret: dysfunction in your 

Priyanka Patel: life.

And, you know, maybe a lot 

Margaret: of like shame and feelings of embarrassment. 

Priyanka Patel: Oh, trust me. It was so much aggro for me, like, you know, and it was that one small thing. And, um, you know, I guess it was just kind of the tip of the iceberg for it. So I think that's what led me to, when I went to the GP eventually, and I was just like, look, I'm not leaving until you refer me.

And if you're not going to refer me, I want it in writing to tell me why. And then, you know, I whipped out the, [00:16:00] um, DSM five. And I was just there like, you know, venting about my entire shitshow of life. Like, you know, this is, this is it. And I was just like, look, I've got these, I've got all of this. Look, I've even highlighted it for you.

Um, so thankfully she ended up referring me. And then I don't know if it's similar in the US, but in the UK, there is a really, really, really long wait at the moment when it comes to getting diagnosed. How long is the 

Margaret: wait list? 

Priyanka Patel: In some areas, it's up to eight years until you can get seen. Yeah. 

Margaret: Ours is at like six to 12 months.

I would say, depending on what kind of specialist you want to pay. 

Priyanka Patel: See if you want to pay, so that's a little different. So that's, that's under the NHS. So like, I assume you guys are familiar with the NHS. Yeah. So we're probably how you are with our 

Margaret: healthcare system. 

Priyanka Patel: Yeah. Kind of. Yeah. So everyone pays something called a national insurance and that basically funds the national health service.

So you can go to a [00:17:00] GP, you can go to a hospital, get a surgery and you know, it's not things that you have to pay for out of your pocket, but then there's obviously private. thing, private care. So, you know, this is where you pay like, I think what's similar for with America where it's like you can pay in private health insurance and then you can go to these private hospitals and claim their insurance and all of that.

But most of the time people don't need to do that. Um, but it's, it's to the point now that the ADHD waiting lists are so long. GPs are telling people you just need to go private because it's that bad. And then there's a whole other issue now of GPs. Being quite wary about private diagnosis, not wanting to accept it because it's private.

But anyway, um, had an absolute mare with the ADHD clinic just trying to get through in the first place. Um, and then yeah, I, I remember like when I, you know, got my diagnosis, it was a couple of, um, assessments, which is really long. And then I remember I had to do the, you have to do two, um, [00:18:00] questionnaires.

So I gave one to my fiance, which is for like the adult. And then I gave one to my parents. And it was so funny because we were just sitting there pulling it out and we were just like talking about my childhood and my both my parents look so stressed, just thinking about it, just like going through it was bad.

And it was like, you know, often and very often for literally like everything. And I'm just sitting there like, interesting. Wow. Interesting. It's taken what? 27 years. Yeah. 27. Okay. Yeah. Nice. Okay. Um. So yeah, so that was all done. And then yeah, I, when I got my diagnosis, like I literally, I think I spent an entire day crying.

Like I didn't think I could believe it because it's a very, very big moment because you spend your entire life thinking you are just useless. You're lazy. Like you see other people flourishing and you keep telling yourself, like you're trying, you're trying, but people don't believe you. And no matter what you do, there is just everything that's going wrong.

And it's, I always tell people having ADHD, [00:19:00] Is literally like firefighting and the fires just keep spreading and you know, it's just, it's just absolute chaos. 

Preston: So when you were crying that day, what emotions were you feeling? Was it? I understand maybe it's relief or feeling validated that you have this diagnosis.

Priyanka Patel: It was a mix. I think the Initially, it was very like, I'm, I do not explain the emotion, but it was kind of like, I'm so glad I believed in myself and like, didn't let people kind of, you know, make me think that I was being stupid about this. Like my hunch was right. I knew there was 

Preston: something wrong. 

Priyanka Patel: I knew that.

Yeah. It was like, I'm not broken. But your story 

Margaret: is not uncommon clinically for like, Especially in women, especially, you know, inattentive subtype, non, uh, you know, male or female identifying, not inattentive type. 

Priyanka Patel: And the sad thing is though, the impact of that as well is, you know, [00:20:00] getting diagnosed as an adult, you're more likely to have a mental health condition in the future.

And those years of, you know, literally constant negative messages, your self esteem is in the gutter. You know, people with ADHD, their self esteem is non existent. And even if they have been diagnosed as a child, it's non existent. But it's even worse when you're an adult. And trying to get out of that mindset is near impossible.

So, you know, and I think one of the biggest revelations of one of the, you know, a lot of people also, they think, right, this is the answer. Getting this diagnosis is going to be the answer. No, that is just the beginning because then it opens up a whole other can of worms, like, you know, then you've got to decide, right, okay, do I want to go medication?

And then you're trying to understand and think, right, so what is ADHD or what is me actually having a bad habit that I need to work on? And that's, no one teaches you this, you know, so you, you know, it's, it's so hard and it's so hard to understand [00:21:00] yourself and try and figure out, right, where, where do I take responsibility on when, where do I don't.

And, um, A lot of people describe this as going through the five stages of grief and I 100 percent believe that. Um, because, you know, I think it's, it's a lot, it's an emotional roller coaster after getting diagnosed. And I remember feeling a lot of like resentment and betrayal towards my parents because I was like thinking and reminiscing back to My, you know, growing up, you know, I didn't have many friends.

I was often seen as the really, like the crybaby, someone, you know, I was known as the, the, the crazy one. And, you know, it was just a lot of negative labels that were kind of attached to me and. It was kind of like, I'm not saying all of it would have been avoided, but at least I could have had a sort of understanding about it and learn how to Even the 

Margaret: internal sense of like you making sense of what it was and like what people were saying that, what you're saying.

And I think I've [00:22:00] heard this fairly often is, oh, what if it was a neutral difference about my brain or even if not totally neutral, it was a difference about my brain that could be understood rather than a moral or personal or personality. Deficit in me and like developmentally and then the making sense of yourself.

I think that is so hard, especially when you're socialized as a girl and then as a woman for who are expected to be polite and clean and quiet and organized more. So 

Priyanka Patel: yeah, and then growing up in an Indian culture as well, like those expectations of all the women are even there's even more pressure. You know, I got in trouble so much because, you know, there's something like, I don't know if it's just to do with my family or I think this is, it's just sometimes Indian culture can be very misogynistic and I, I don't, I'm not for that at all to the point that I noticed like all the time at like our family gatherings and stuff, you [00:23:00] know, the women would cook, then the men would eat first, then the kids would eat.

Then the women would eat last, and then they would clean up and everything. And I would always make a point, I'd go before all the uncles and my dad and stuff, like, listen, I'm hungry as well. Like, just because you're a man doesn't mean you get to eat before me. You know, if you get there before me, fair enough, but I'm not going to go behind you if we're there at the same time.

And I always got in so much trouble. I was, you know, told I was disrespectful. I was loud. And, you know, I think as well, I don't know if this is ADHD specifically or neurodiverse as a whole, but for me, it's like, I don't, Like doing things I don't understand or I don't It doesn't make sense. And that's why I'm not a religious person.

I just believe just be nice to everyone. Don't be a dick, right? Just respect people. 

Margaret: It sounds like there is a lot of, like, both in terms of maybe how your ADHD or how your brain worked or didn't work in that environment. And then also these other parts of being raised in a culture and how that matched with your own [00:24:00] values and personality and development versus not making sense of all of that in addition to the, like, ADHD part has made things really confusing and sometimes painful.

Yeah, 

Priyanka Patel: it was a double whammy, you know, because you only, you don't only feel like such an outsider culturally, but then also even socially, you know, and it's just, it's everything like, you know, being a woman, being a woman of color, and then those two together, it's just, it's, I think it's even harder. And I feel like I'm starting to kind of get to the point where I'm trying, like, finally kind of accepting who I am.

And, you know, I think, like, I'm 30 now, so I think I'm at an age where I'm very sure of myself. And I'm like, do you know what? I just, People can say what they want about me now, that auntie can say this, that uncle can say that about me, I'm loud, cool, you don't like my hair, cool, I don't care, I'm happy, like, you know, just, I think people just, you know, just, uh, accept everyone's differences, that's what the thing is, because I think, you know, with ADHD and neurodiversity, and I saw this article, it's actually really good, it was, it was [00:25:00] explaining how we speak different social languages, it was, And no one's right, and no one's wrong, but the norm is neurotypical, so when you don't fit into that, you're the, you're the wrong one, you're the broken one, but it's just like, hold on, no, like, you know, it's literally like you're speaking French, I'm speaking Italian, where, you know, it's, it's, it's, it's not, lot more 

Margaret: compassion in, I think, The language of that, right?

Like I was saying, we're speaking different, uh, kind of social languages and how do we make more space for diversity in a lot of different ways, rather than kind of contracting it on ourselves and saying one way is right. Or these people who are different than me are bad and Preston, I think you were wanting to say something.

I know you had. 

Preston: Yeah, so. Regarding the question is like, where does Priyanka and and where does ADHD start seems to be like something you've been toiling with. And 1 thing I've seen with my patients is that there may be some traits from their ADHD that they had and that kind of led to their moral conclusions.

So, like, for example, fasting is something that requires a lot of restraint. [00:26:00] And if you're in a culture where you have to fast and you and you struggle. Neurologically with impulsivity, I wonder if, you know, doing impulsive things could lead you to be in trouble and then make the conclusion like, hey, these I think these ethical frameworks are actually stupid because it's really hard to follow them.

Just just like how if I was bad at math, maybe I would hate school. So, I guess, or you internalize it and say I'm bad. Yeah, I wonder if, if, When you try to think about where does ADHD end and Priyanka start, I guess I'm curious like any behaviors change that you noticed when you did start medication and did that lead to any like changes and conclusions about some of these things in your life?

Priyanka Patel: So I initially start was started on concerted. So that was methylphenidate and I thought it was working, but actually it was because I was coming off metazapine. And I guess once that came out of my system, I felt like a whole person. And then, um, I guess I thought the concerto was actually helping when in fact, it was [00:27:00] actually just the metazapine just not being in my system.

So after a few months I was like, wait, everything is still bad. So, um, then there was this 

Preston: What told you that it was helping? 

Margaret: Yeah, 

Priyanka Patel: I felt like I could do things again. I felt a bit more in control of my emotions. I didn't feel as angry anymore. Um, and obviously appetite. Was suppressed as well. But if you think about the side effects of metazapine increased appetite, sleepiness.

Um, being lethargic, um, anger as well. So all of those went and that is those taking that away is quite sometimes can be incorrectly attributed to an ADHD medication. So, um, after a few months I was like, you know what? No, this is not working. Um, and then there was a whole palaver by ADHD clinic shut down and then just.

Left me. Oh, wow. Yeah, it was, it was a nightmare. So I then actually, um, had to go find another one. And then that's when I controlled 

Margaret: our stimulants in the UK. [00:28:00] Like, do you have in the US people depends on the state, but you generally have to get a new prescription every 30 days. You can't write it earlier for people.

Is that how it is in the UK as 

Priyanka Patel: well? Listen really hard then. 

Margaret: Yes. 

Priyanka Patel: ADHD meds are close to drugs. So that's like that they have the strictest. So. Not only are there requirements on the prescriptions, um, like you said, 30 days, the, um, prescriptions are valid for 28 days, you have to log them in and out as well.

So there's a lot that goes in. And then when I then went to the other clinic, um, and I basically just told her everything, she was like, yeah, your ADHD meds, like they're not working for you at all. And I was like, oh, so it does get better, right? You promised. And she was like, well, hopefully, but all I will say is when ADHD meds work.

It's not that. So I was like, okay, good. So there's hope. I'm not a lost cause. And then that's when the L Vance shortages happened. So I couldn't even start on titration. Um, so yeah, it was just, uh, it was a bit of a rough time. And then finally I got put onto L Vance and [00:29:00] then that was when I was like, wow, okay, so this is what ADHD medication can do.

Margaret: Is that less dexamphetamine? 

Priyanka Patel: Yeah. 

Margaret: So 

Priyanka Patel: that was worked a lot better 

Margaret: for listeners. 

Priyanka Patel: Yes. Yes. You guys pull it by Vance. Um, and that's when I was like, normally when I want to do something, I, my, my head runs through like a billion thoughts and then it literally jumps from one thing to another, to another, to another.

But when I was on now, Vance, it was like, I could just do it. It was, it's so weird. I can't even explain it. It was like, okay, I've got to go put this plate and I'll just go do it. Whereas previously, I would not only procrastinate that, but then, you know, I would somehow end up doing something else. And then next thing you know, I'm in, in the bathroom with my plate and I'm like, okay, what's, what's happened?

Um, yeah, and yeah, how did I end up 

Margaret: here? 

Priyanka Patel: Yeah, literally. And, uh, I could, I could focus on things that I normally just would much rather like tear my skin off than do. Like my [00:30:00] work was, was like my work, uh, performance was a lot better. Um, I had a lot more like mental capacity to actually like talk to people.

I didn't feel so like, um, I don't know how to describe it. It's very, it's, um, it's difficult. It just, it felt like I could just function, you know, that's the only way to describe it. Um, but then what I started noticing was when it was getting to about 1, 2 PM in the afternoon, I then started to lag a lot.

And that's when a lot of the research that I do. So a lot of the stuff I talk about online is about the gender differences when it comes to ADHD symptoms, but most importantly, medication. And I did, um, a scoping review, um, last year, and there, there are only seven studies in the entire world that have separated results based on gender, which is shocking.

But from what they also found is that women metabolize, oh, that's a lot faster than men. [00:31:00] So that led me to think, actually, what if LVANCE has been cleared out of my system a lot faster and it doesn't actually last long enough? And, um, so I spoke to my psychiatrist about this, you know, and I sent her all the journals and stuff.

I was like, have a look yourself. And then, so that's when I, we decided to try something because this was something that I have been suggesting for practice to start looking into, which is about, adjusting medication based on the patient and their gender and their profile rather than just looking at guidance and saying, okay, this is what we should do.

You know, if you've got a patient that's a fast metabolizer, you know, they, they do that anyway with certain other medicines, but if it's to do with gender, isn't something that they think about. So then I got put on short acting dexamphetamine. So that's, I don't know if you have that. In the, in the U. S. Um, dexamphetamine.

We just use mixed 

Preston: amphetamine salts. Yeah, 

Priyanka Patel: we don't, we don't have um, Adderall here. We don't, we don't have that one. Um, so, this one's dexamphetamine. So, it's basic, so, you know, [00:32:00] lisdexamphetamine, 5 ants. It's a pro drug. So, it's actually dexamphetamine that's working in your system anyway. Um, but, it's really, it's a really clever medication.

In fact, the fact that no matter how you alter it, you cannot increase its effects. Or speed up the release of it because it relies on an enzyme reaction in the blood to split the amino acid. So, you know, it's the dexamphetamine that has its effect. So I then, in the afternoon, take a short acting dexamphetamine and that works brilliantly.

And now we've got another Savannah in the works. When, when I decided to come off hormonal contraception, which I was needing to for my endometriosis, um, I started to not only realize and then eventually get diagnosed with PMDD, but also there were certain times in my cycle where I felt my medication was just not working at all.

And so that's another part of my research, which I do, which is about the. Adjusting your lifestyle and your [00:33:00] medication and recognizing symptom patterns and fluctuations in accordance with the mental, mental, menstrual cycle. So now what I do is I take an extra top up dose during the last half of my cycle because otherwise nothing will work for me.

So through like experimenting When you 

Margaret: say, like, you mentioned a scoping review and you mentioned your research, um, what do you, what do you mean by Because I feel like that can mean a whole bunch of different things. So I'm wondering What you mean by your research? 

Priyanka Patel: So, um, there's, it's been quite, um, disjointed.

Uh, let's just say there's been a lot of, uh, pushback because it doesn't, some people just don't see any benefit or value. I've said to me, I think your research is going to be a waste of time. Um, so it's been quite difficult trying to get it up and running. Um, but what has actually happened is what I wanted to do, uh, a clinic in the [00:34:00] Netherlands have done it.

So I think it was back in April, actually. Um, and they basically did, yeah, they did a very small study. Yeah. Like nine women or something where yeah, it was, 

Margaret: yep. 

Priyanka Patel: Honestly, I saw that and I literally was just like, I read it like 10 times, so I was like, Oh my God, it's happening. Finally, it's starting to happen.

Oh my God, I knew it. I predicted it. I knew this was, this was some, like, this was needed. Like, someone's seen the value in this, like, and so they did two different types of studies. One where they actually adjusted like, um, the kind of non medical side of it, um, through like the kind of Talking and counseling types are parts of it.

And then the other side is where they adjusted the stimulant doses based on the menstrual cycle. So, um, my scoping review that I've initially done, which has been, I've been meaning to write up for like two years now, but, um, the, the whole point of it was basically to scope the literature and to find out, right, what is needed, what have we found?

And I already know what we found. Is that [00:35:00] women do need to be medicated differently and they should not be treated in accordance with guidance that has all been based on studies done on men. So, and it's, I think to this day, and what really alarms me is Vyvanse, I don't know if the same regulations as America in the UK, but a 55 year old woman in menopause and a six year old boy would both be given Vyvanse at the same dose.

And to me, I find that so alarming, like, how, like, make that make sense. And no one's taken a moment to think, hmm, that doesn't sound right. You know, that, like, how is that okay? And so there's so much research out there, which is constantly showing us, right, this is wrong, that is wrong, this is wrong. But I'm like, why is no one doing anything about it?

So. When you look, 

Margaret: I think the history of mental health research and women and an adult ADHD is we did an episode on ADHD talk touching on some of this of the history of ADHD, the history of it being child versus adult and how long it lasts. And then the gender [00:36:00] differences has prevented a lot. Um, and then this kind of broader problem in health research of.

Who gets to be in the studies who get who are we looking at do we look like that there's oftentimes like menstruating or reproductive age women are not included because the complexity of the hormonal cycle and they worry that I'll, you know, whatever, which is not, it's not a good reason. Like there's no other health condition.

We're like, it's a little too complicated. Let's not do it. 

Priyanka Patel: Um, doing clinical trials on HRT. They tried it on men first. That's how ridiculous I didn't know that. Some of this is. 

Preston: I noticed that your username on TikTok is little miss ADHD. And I guess I imagine you didn't start out with that as your username.

Um, because you started on a tech talk before you diagnosed, right? 

Priyanka Patel: Yeah. So it was, it was, I can't even remember what it was actually. 

Preston: So what was that transition like? Like, what inspired the name, I guess? And what was the reception of that like? 

Priyanka Patel: Do you know what? I actually have no idea [00:37:00] why I chose that name.

And do you know what? Now that I think about it, I don't know if this is a neurodiverse thing, but I have a very, like, I'm a very child inside. I still listen to Disney songs. I have a Disney hits playlist I listen to on a daily basis without fail. I still watch reruns of like, That's So Raven, Suite Life of Zack and Cody, like, 90s films, everything.

So, I feel maybe that there was a part of me that just, you know, wanted to connect to a child version of me, which is what maybe made me want to kind of lean towards that. Um, because you know, the little Miss Little Men books are something that we remember quite fondly as kids. And um, I just thought it was a way for me to kind of just not take myself too seriously as well without, um, kind of also taking the seriousness away from what it is because sometimes, yeah, people have, you know, rightly so said to me, you know, [00:38:00] say having a username like that does, you know, make it seem like a juvenile thing.

And I was like, do you know what, that's, that's fair enough. But it's something that I resonate with. Personally. Um, so, you know, you can take what you can from there, but you know, I guess it's just a lot of when you do see my content and stuff, you'll, you'll realize that no, it's not kind of all to do with just that kind of stuff.

So, you know, kind of, um, what's the word I'm having another mind blank. I can't even remember, but. But yeah, I just, I, I, it was so long ago, I can't actually remember, and I still remember now that I couldn't even have the name Little Miss ADHD as a full, I had to put these bloody underscores in because there was some random account with like five followers that had the username I wanted, and then I had to put fiddle around with these underscores.

Um, but yeah, it was ages ago, years ago, honestly. And, um, yeah, I've never actually, um, thought about it for a while, actually, in terms of what, what led to that. [00:39:00] And no, funnily enough, no one's ever actually asked me that question. 

Preston: Oh, um, well, thank you for sharing it. It's interesting to see how this name was almost like a reclamation of your youth or kind of something like the wonder you had.

And then also, I think the goal was to kind of take some of the power away from ADHD and how much I had over you by kind of associated with this, these, like, little miss books from your childhood. Yeah, I'm, I'm curious, like, now, 1 of your videos that struck me the most actually was when you were talking about how ADHD can be almost like gimmickified and people treat it like it's like a fun quirk and that frustrates you.

And, and you kind of like shared experiences about how much ADHD causes a detriment to your life, which we've seen here, um, even like with the keys example, and having trouble with the hospital, where do you, or like, how do you balance the normalization of mental health and like the stigmatization of it all the way down to, I guess, sense of sensationalization, [00:40:00] almost like the fantastical glorification of it.

Because I think We live on the spectrum. It's hard to navigate. And I was kind of curious, like, how do you find that needle for yourself? 

Priyanka Patel: Yeah. And that that's like, that's such an interesting question, because I think there's a very, very thin line between what could be taken as something that dismisses mental health and ADHD and then something that takes, you know, is serious.

And I get so personally, what I do is like, if I'm going to Maybe like a humorous video or something that is maybe like very unserious, you know I will always put like a disclaimer saying like, you know I'd be the other time I put a video of when you know I had a couple of friends around for my 30th birthday and I forced them to play Disney songs And it's just the montage of videos of me just singing along to Hannah Montana and Camp Rock and um, 

Preston: nice.

Priyanka Patel: And I was just like, yeah, you, you know, I might cry when I, when I come. Exactly. Yeah. I was like, I might cry when I do the dishes, but at least my DH ADHD makes me entertaining, you know? So, um, and then I put like [00:41:00] a little thing in the box and I said, you know, please don't take this as a representation of A DHD.

And I think that is what's important because that's what the, and I think that is probably. I won't say it'd be a solution, but I think it's a, it's a great way for people to kind of understand that social media is great for people sharing their lived experience. And that's what people are seeing is a lived experience, but it's not where you can't take it.

Like you said, as. a diagnostic criteria or symptom list. And I think that's where the confusion happens. So as someone like, you know, who has a following that, you know, watch and as a pharmacist, I, I, you know, I'm, I'm regulated as well. So I'm very careful about the content I put out. I'm really specific and say, look, anytime I put out content, I just say, first of all, this is informative stuff if I'm explaining about medication or, you know, a symptom or something like that.

But if it's [00:42:00] like a personal thing, I always say, look, this is a lived experience. This is my experience of ADHD. Um, I can't, no one can describe or, you know, illustrate the whole spectrum of what ADHD is in a TikTok video. It's, it's not possible. So as a viewer, you also have to take accountability and, you know, take a step back and think, okay, this is a TikTok video at social media, you know, it's where ways for people to connect and share and just sometimes have a bit of fun, you know?

So it's, it's, I think always about being very, very open and honest. And then what I also do is every time I'm going to post something, I think, okay. What value am I adding? Like, is this, I am very passionate about wanting to raise awareness, help people, make sure that people are getting the right information and advocating for women's rights when it comes to mental health and healthcare in general.

So when I put out content, that's what I'm aiming to do. And, you know, that's why I kind of, I steer away from the short, fast [00:43:00] videos. And again, no disrespect people do that. But for me, I don't feel like I'm adding. the value I want to, you know, social media. So that's why a lot of my videos can be quite long at times or might be quite like, they're always to the face cause I'm just, sorry to the camera, cause I'm just like face talking about everything.

But, um, yeah, it's, uh, it's, uh, tricky trying to balance. Um, 

Preston: yeah, what has been some of the hardest or harshest responses you've got in trying to talk about this stuff? It's a bit of a mind field navigating and ask someone who, like, I talk about mental health too. And I feel you on that. Like, my informative videos are like, 10 minutes.

Like, I go to the limit each time because I'm like, trying to pack as much nuance as I can into these things. And so. I guess, like, you've been a lot more forward than I have in the fact that, like, you're talking about your personal diagnosis and your personal experience, where I can kind of, like, come at it from the perception of a clinician who's just talking about the science, but I'm not putting myself on the [00:44:00] line like you are.

Priyanka Patel: Um, so I've had, I've had people question my competence as a People have said in the comments like, I would not trust you to give me my medication because you have ADHD or things like that and I think that, those types of comments were, I think, the most hurtful that I received and I think it comes from a lot when you have a condition like ADHD you know, it's hold, it's held you back so much I have worked my socks off to get to where I have You know, I am in a position where, you know, I am, I am able to, like, my, my job is incredible.

I work half with the NHS and I work half, I teach at a university, you know, and I get to educate the next cohorts of pharmacists, you know, I get to dwell in research. I get to do the things of social media that I love, you know, like I'm writing a book and. I, despite everything I've [00:45:00] accomplished so much, and I always say that it's not because of, you know, despite ADHD, it's because of my ADHD.

Once you figure out, like, when you have ADHD, everyone, regardless of ADHD or not, everyone has got strengths and weaknesses. But we live in a society that doesn't value or cherish the strengths of neurodiverse people. So, when you're neurodiverse, you have to live your life differently. And there's nothing wrong with that.

So that's what I've learned to do. And it's like, okay, so I'm creative. I'm great with, um, spontaneity. I like talking. And I've built my life around my strengths rather than focusing so much on, Oh, I forgot this. Oh, I can't organize that. I can't do this. And find ways to manage that and just accept that I'm not going to be good at that.

And that's okay. And, you know, so I think those, those kinds of comments initially, what I used to really get to me, but then always you get those typical, like, Oh, ADHD isn't real and, you know, things like that. And I'm just like, all right, Anon327, thank you for your very [00:46:00] valuable input. And it's, it's just, it's always the, you know, the people that just, you know, I just imagine them sitting in like a basement or something.

And you know, I just, well, I just don't understand, I'll never, I'll never understand this. It's like someone is taking their time out of the day, they're scrolling on their phone. To go insult someone they don't even know I will never understand that in my I will never get it. But, um, I think like I'm 

Margaret: just laughing because we talk about Preston is a conspiracy that I have false accounts that go and comment negative things on his because 

Preston: I can't imagine anyone else who would have a negative opinion of me.

Margaret: I'm like, 

Preston: I'm like, damn it, Margaret, again, someone's just like, they're like. Your face is ugly and like, psychiatry is a scam and I'm just like, Margaret, 

Margaret: 6 in the morning, 

Preston: how is she up? 

Margaret: Just gotta get my reps in, you know? It's like, some people do the, [00:47:00] uh, New York Times, like, wordle, whatever. Those things, I'm just, I'm in his comments.

She's doing 

Preston: it reluctantly, like rolling over, like, ugh, like, 

Margaret: Another day. 

Preston: She says time 

Priyanka Patel: is, she says time is and You know, for which accounts? Yeah. 

Preston: Excuse me. One second. My five o'clock's here. 

Margaret: I have a teeny tiny, like, blues clues, detective notebook where I'm like, Oh, that's I'll be on rounds and just be like, wait, wait, wait, this is a good, this is really gonna hurt.

Preston: So one thing I've noticed on social media is how People can use like kind of their identity around an illness to destigmatize and normalize it. So someone who kind of makes their account about talking about their personal experience with autism and we have you with ADHD and there are other people that take it do the same thing for treatable illnesses.

And I kind of like, I wonder how we navigate the spectrum of labeling ourselves with or like using these illnesses as part of our identity. And I guess what comes to mind is what if there was like a little miss [00:48:00] depression? Hypothetically, and now this person's contents built all around their depression.

Do they lose their identity when they treat their depression? Like, were they to come out of this mood episode or something? 

Priyanka Patel: Yeah, 

Preston: I guess. Like, I'm curious, like, If you were to kind of give a line or or say, what are some criteria to make it more or less acceptable to kind of incorporate a diagnosis into a part of your identity, or you're like representation of yourself to the public?

Priyanka Patel: Wow. You've got some really interesting questions. That's a, that's a tricky one to ask, because you're really making me think. What, it's a Friday evening. I'm 

Preston: sorry, sorry about that. Yeah, it's like 10pm and I'm like, I'm like, we're going to get to the philosophical core. I know, you're giving me like 

Priyanka Patel: brain teasers right now, and I'm just like, listen, like, my brain is not computing.

You're really devastating. Um, I, you know. I think when it comes to something like that, I personally think it's more about when you go, for [00:49:00] example, to someone's profile, it helps them see what your content is about. It helps them see, you know, what, if they want to follow, they want to follow because they're interested in that content.

So when you have like, you know, a condition or something in your username. It tells people that your page is going to be around that subject and, you know, people might want to follow and watch that content for, I don't know, maybe to feel not alone. So, you know, they're maybe baffling with it and they want to, you know, it's a great, one thing I love about social media is that I know it's an online community, but It really helps with that loneliness at times and knowing that you are not the only one going through things because people share so much around their experiences.

Um, but then there's also people who, you know, they just want to learn about it or, you know, find out more. Maybe they've got. a loved one that has something like condition and they want to find out more or, you know, maybe they just like the way this creator is, you know, sharing stuff around it. Maybe they, you know, find [00:50:00] humor in it or, you know, they share strategies on how they manage it or, you know, they share the really messy parts and the really difficult parts of what it's like.

So they, that's how they de stigmatize it. And I think that's the way that I. I go around doing it. So like, you know, obviously I've got ADHD in my username. So people will know that my content is going to be around ADHD. And yes, I create videos where, you know, it's very like good talks to the camera and I'm talking about amino acids and, you know, receptors and things like that, but then there's also videos where I'm there telling people about, you know.

How, what did I do the other day with the, with the postman? I made him wait for like 10 minutes cause I couldn't find the bloody sellotape. And I was there like faffing around and, you know, sharing, sharing anecdotes of my life or like sharing videos of myself where I'm at my uttermost low and sharing.

Successes as well. Like I share all types of things to do with myself professionally and personally, and I think that's why I think a lot [00:51:00] of people do value some of the content I make, because I don't put this picture perfect kind of persona up. I am so far from that, honestly. And I think that's what helps people see when, you know, when you have a condition like ADHD, it doesn't.

That's what destigmatizes it because you're showing the dark sides of it, but then you're also showing the parts that we need. We can also love about ourselves as well. Like ADHD doesn't always have to be so, so doom and gloom all the time. And you know, yes, it's a serious condition and we have to respect that, but at times you can have a bit of a laugh about yourself as well.

And, um, you know, so that's why I think. Um, you know, and a lot of the people that I have made friends with online, like, you know, they're quite similar as well. And they're very vulnerable online on social media. And that's what I think is really building up such a wholesome community of people. And it's just so nice.

Sometimes I see, I get messages all the time, people just saying like, you know, how much sometime I'm not just like, I'm literally just like, I've really Small woman in [00:52:00] UK in, in, in Manchester. Right. And you're there telling me how much my content has changed your life. And I'm like, it's sometimes it's just doesn't feel real.

Like I'm just, I will literally just get up and I'm just there ranting about the dishwasher. And I'm like, you're, you're telling some of this content is what's making this changing your life. And it's, it's incredible just to, to know that you're making that difference. And, um, that's why, you know, I always just, I'm just like, sure.

I don't care about having to look. Perfect or having to say the right things, you know, if you want, if you're going to have username and you're going to talk about ADHD, you've got to show what it's like having it and the, you know, all the disjointed parts of it as well. But so, yeah, I hope I even answer the question.

I don't know what the question was. It sounds like 

Preston: variety is really kind of the solution to navigating this. Pigeonholing problem we get with, um, kind of labeling ourselves. So by saying your little miss ADHD, you're showing all the faces of ADHD. So, in a way, your content isn't revolving [00:53:00] around only your vulnerability with the pathology of it, but rather the educational aspects, the success, like, the triumphs and other things that relate to it.

I think what came to mind with me when it comes to using diseases as. Our identities is whether or not it's curable or manageable. So if, if you had something like, um, another creator who talks about their autism is mostly a manageable condition or a neurodivergence as, as, um, you discussed is something that like, they're always going to be kind of dealing with throughout their life.

Yeah. 

Priyanka Patel: Yeah. 

Preston: Whereas to go an extreme on the other end, like, if I had a UTI. I don't think I'd make my entire account around like, like, I would hope that I would hear it by the end 

Margaret: of the week. Yeah, exactly. The UTI guy. Can we write that down? 

Preston: Yeah, exactly. 

Margaret: Psychiatrist specializing in UTIs. 

Preston: Right now, all my contents around living with a UTI and everyone's like, Preston, just, just take [00:54:00] some ciprofloxacin and I'm like, but that's not my content, you know?

Priyanka Patel: Is it really messed up that I should be interested in seeing that content, because like, what would you even be talking about? I 

Preston: think that would be an ugly 

Priyanka Patel: thing. What would you even be talking about? I would have to

Preston: So I think like Um, basically, your ability just came to mind in that aspect. So it's like, okay, this is something that that is stuck with me. So I have to learn to have a relationship with this disorder because it's not something that I can cure and get off of my body. And on top of that, how do I show all the faces of it as we go through that?

So I think that's kind of like something that you've been able to flesh out or really furnish the details of yeah. Of ADHD and give it personality because we often see it almost like monolithically and have our specific ideas of what a disorder looks like. 

Priyanka Patel: Yeah, and I think it was, um, when it comes to conditions like ADHD, autism, and when you compare it to mental health conditions, you know, I mean, I [00:55:00] think sometimes some people put them all together when it's, it's not like that, like, um, Mental health conditions are more or less known for, you know, they can flare up and then they can be like symptom symptomless at times.

They can be triggered, uh, by certain things. Like not every single person, like is gonna ha is gonna be depressed throughout their entire life every day. But conditions like addiction, autism, you know, they, they're, they are neurological, um, disease, um, conditions. And so your, that's, and some people I think I often get asked and, you know, say like, so.

You make a whole personality about ADHD and I'm like, but it is like, my, my brain is different, like, I am ADHD because ADHD is my brain. That's why the condition is called ADHD because it relates to us having a different brain that works differently. So my brain basically makes me as a person and what I've also noticed and hopefully if anyone who has ADHD is listening to this as well [00:56:00] is, you know, We tend to be so hard on ourselves all the time, you know, we do this wrong, we do that wrong, we compare ourselves to everyone and, you know, I don't think we ever sit there and take a moment to think about what do we actually like about ourselves because we have got so many external messages about what's wrong with us.

That we then end up not only internalizing it, but then that becomes part of identity and just eats away at us. What I then started to realize was the things that I love the most about myself were things like my insane ability to go above and beyond and care for people. You know, um, the way that I can have, you know, I just see the fun in things, the lighthearted side of things.

You know, I, when I am interested in a, in a topic, I will go next level and do incredible things in the space of a couple of hours. You know, I am always willing to try new things. I will try new hobbies, go to new places. And that's when I realized all of these things that I love about myself are [00:57:00] actually things due to having ADHD.

So that's what changed my relationship with ADHD instead of being so down in the dumps about it. And, you know, berating myself, all the things I can't do. I started to try and see it the other way, and that doesn't take away from how much this condition, you know, derails my life, but it makes it a bit more manageable, because I'm just like Yeah, like I thought, you know, I left the clothes in the dishwasher again, but, you know, look at this pretty picture that I made because I'm really creative.

Um, so, you know, just, just try and, um, yeah, 

Preston: on one hand, impulsivity leads to spending money or getting into trouble. But on the other hand, impulsivity primes you to be more likely to try new things. 

Priyanka Patel: Yeah, there's always like, you're experiencing 

Preston: both sides of that, but it's different 

Priyanka Patel: for every single person.

So that's the thing. Like, there might be some people who's impulsivity Leads to really disastrous consequences compared to anything good. Um, and so they might not see their impulsivity as anything good, but [00:58:00] everyone, ADHD or not, has got strengths and weaknesses. And it's about no matter who you are as a person, try and value yourself for your strengths.

And that's why people with ADHD find it so much harder because who cares that, you know, we can like, um, we can sit there for five hours and learn everything to know about, like. You know, the, how the earth was made or whatever, you know, no one cares about that, but, you know, if you make it on time to work.

You're an amazing, responsible work employee. And, uh, you know, so I think that's why 

Margaret: redefining what is that? What are the parts of you that you really value? And that comes from, yeah, 

Priyanka Patel: like we rely so much on external validation because we're so used to people externally berating us that we're like, okay, now can you be nice to us, please?

So it's like, no, do it yourself. Like, you shouldn't need someone else to tell you that you're creative or you're caring or this and that, but you know it. [00:59:00] Yourself. And once you stop, it's just about just don't care what people say or think. And it's hard. It's so hard. And I'm still not there. Like, you know, I think it's that sensitivity is so hard.

Even with my fiance, like he'll, he'll say something in a different tone. I'm like, are you breaking up with me? Like, what am I done? Um, so it's, you know, it's not, it's just, yeah, it's a, it's hard. It's very, very hard. 

Preston: So we're going to take a break. And then when we come back, I want to kind of Talk about the future of this landscape and what, what do you think, or what changes you want to see in, um, the mental health field.

And then we can kind of wrap up and talk about some of your projects.

So now seeing how tick tock has been evolving in this kind of social media landscape, what do you think is the ideal way we talk about things like ADHD? And I guess what changes would you like to see? 

Priyanka Patel: [01:00:00] So I guess obviously like this, something like this is very subjective. So like I said, I think if you have a big following, you do have a responsibility for what you're sharing.

And I think a lot of creators should start understanding that as well. Like there was, there's, you know, I completely understand, you know, you can post whatever you want and, you know, you've got whatever rights to post whatever you want on social media, but it's, it's just about understanding that those ethics and morals about when you have a big following, what influence you're going to have a big influence on, on what you're sharing.

So it's about understanding the impact of that. And so putting disclaimers in the video 

Margaret: with, with that, like, I think that there's so much in mental health that like people want care, like there's wait lists, there's this, there's like finding a match for a therapist and other things. And A lot of pain and people go online [01:01:00] and, you know, I think there's a way for creators who aren't in the field to talk about this really complex topic in a way that is.

Destigmatizing and helpful without being too much misinformation. I mean, all of us know like how many years we've been doing this and I'm still like now, I don't know that you should listen to me because I think this is right. But I don't know if I'm interpreting it correctly, but like how people talk about it and how they frame it as like this worked for me.

And here's my story of mental health versus Yeah. This should always be the thing your doctor's lying to you or your therapist is lying to you for whatever if this is not talked about in this way, that kind of polarization, I feel like, is a part of the change in the landscape that includes this ethical part.

Priyanka Patel: Yeah, definitely. That's that's yeah, that's pretty good point. I think. Yeah. And, um. I guess, yeah, it's, it's uh, it's a tricky one, but I also do think like, you know, whatever you're sharing, like, this is why I put disclaimers in all my videos as well, all the time, like, don't ever take my advice as direct medical advice.

[01:02:00] You know, there are people, it's insane. I have people messaging me all the time, sending me all of their health problems and they want help on what to do about their medication. I'm like, bro, I can't help you like that. Like that's, you know, I can't do that. Some people find my email and I'm like, where did you find my email?

And you're, you're there sending me like a whole like, case study about yourself. Like, you know, and um, It's like, you know, and there's always people in the comments that are very, you know, there's always going to be someone that has something to say. So that's why I say, look, this is just for information, you know, some people might find it beneficial, but, you know, if I'm there talking about a supplement, I don't just go onto Amazon and buy it straight away.

I always say, every single video of mine, it'll either be in the text or it'll be spoken and Most of the time, I try to remember to speak it. I say, if you want to make any changes to anything to do with your health, speak to your doctor or like your relevant clinician. Um, I like, I like describing social media as opening the door.

to kind of [01:03:00] covering some of this stuff. But, um, you know, once you're in the room, it's like, okay, let me have a look around. Let me actually try and make sense of this. And, um, that's, you know, what I think it, I think there needs to be work done on both sides, you know, from creators in terms of how they're putting the content forward in terms of taking a bit more responsibility about.

You know what they're actually putting out there and then viewers for understanding and, you know, they, they can't 

Margaret: how they metabolize it. 

Priyanka Patel: Yeah, like, you know, if you watch a video of someone talking about something the way you perceive it, that's on you without sounding too harsh. Like, you know, we all perceive the world like every single person perceives the world differently, right?

Um, It shouldn't be the person's fault. Who's made the video and the blame shouldn't always be put on them because you've, you know, process the information this way. So I think it's a joint effort to it as well. 

Preston: But it takes 2 to tango. So you have [01:04:00] the gaps in the media literacy on the viewers part and then you have the necessity for caveat and nuance on the producers part.

And so I think the common theme here and I think every society could benefit from From this is improved media literacy, which is something I think here in the U. S. Especially we struggle with, 

Margaret: right? 

Priyanka Patel: Yeah, definitely. 

Margaret: I think I think you also have to ask this and president. I talk about this is the kind of underground question at the both like the shadow, the dark and light sides of not just other people out here, not just other creators out here, but like where we share, um, you know, what am I getting from this?

What is this doing for me? And it's Is that the way I want to be? Because I mean, I believe that like, there's probably some part of me that like, likes posting and talking and stuff in really good, helpful, altruistic ways. And also ways maybe that are about me and me having a need that I want an audience or something to meet, [01:05:00] which I don't think is, I actually don't say that with judgment.

I say it with kind of just observing. I think that's also part of this. They're all the way from like the financial, like, you know, selling a certain X, Y, or Z program or stuff to just like, Noticing within ourselves as creators, like, what, what is the effect? I hope this to have. And also, what does this feel like to me to give this part of, you know, my learning or whatever?

How does it feel to communicate and how do I communicate it? Well, and where examples of people doing communication of these complex things well online and that, like, even when we're trying to do something well, like, even when we're trying to communicate something well, like, how do we have a relationship with what we're putting out there?

I think to me is a complicated question. Of like, how do we realize if we've taken a misstep and Preston, I hate to give you a compliment. I always hate to give you a compliment. You know this, but I think there's been a couple of times where you posted something and your audience, you know, brought something up.

They [01:06:00] didn't like how this was or that was. And you responded to it pretty openly and changed course. 

Preston: Yeah, I think 1 thing that's helped me when 

Priyanka Patel: we 

Preston: talk about this relationship with our content that we put out there and dealing with maybe giving less than ideal information is that it's a dynamic relationship ultimately.

So, when I make a mistake, that's not the final judgment of me as a creator, and I can come back and I can talk about it the next time. And now it's just continues to be a part of my story that or part of the kind of the story following me that. Hey, I messed up now. I'm being honest. I did this wrong and we're correcting course.

And so I think some people have this idea or are afraid that all the content they put out there is going to be permanent, which is true, but it's not the end. I'll be all I guess. 

Priyanka Patel: I do think we need to, I don't like cancel culture online because there's Like you said, there's one slip up and it [01:07:00] could go viral or someone can stitch it and next thing you know, you've got an army of keyboard worries after you.

I mean, there's been times where like I'll see people stitch a video or like retweet a tweet or something and then you'll go into the profile and they've deactivated or like they turned their comments off. Like, I think people are very quick to kind of jump on the cancel culture and I think that's something we do need to kind of.

reflect on because like you said, we're human, we're human beings, we're going to make mistakes, we're going to come back. And if, you know, we, I think if someone has made a mistake online, that they come back and apologize online and take accountability, that's really difficult. And that should be respected.

And, you know, I think it's, it's a very, can be a very harsh world online at times. And I guess it also depends with the kind of. You know, the reach that you get, and I think that's, that's the thing as well, because The bigger my following has gotten, the [01:08:00] more harder it has been in terms of criticism and, you know, I wouldn't say like I'm getting hate all the time, but there is more that comes with the bigger following as well.

And, you know, there is a human being on the other side of that camera who, you know, has feelings and will make mistakes. And I think people forget that because they're looking at a screen. And so, yeah, I think we're just losing a lot of touch with just our human sides when it comes to social media. So it's hard to have that, um, online as well.

So that is something which I think is a bit, I think a bit of a worry at times. I think we all just need to go outside a bit more. 

Margaret: And there's so much of people's personhood in this kind of content, right? That's so close to the heart for a lot of people. And so I'm sure. And also, you know, part of the reason with with that is like that both you and Preston share things that are very close to people's day to day pain and fears.

Priyanka Patel: Are you talking about the video of when he was barking like a dog?[01:09:00] 

Um, 

Margaret: no, that was that recent one, wasn't it, Preston? 

Priyanka Patel: The way his face is so straight. I didn't 

Preston: know there was someone recording. This is how I greet people. I'm not even 

Priyanka Patel: embarrassed to say I literally watched that like five times because I was like, this is, this is so funny. I was just like, why, why would someone do that?

And what makes it even funnier is that you're a psychiatrist. 

Preston: I know somebody commented they're like, they're like not beating the psychiatrist allegations. So

I think this brings us to a good kind of closing point. Thank you Priyanka so much for sharing your story with us and what your experiences have been like. 

Priyanka Patel: It was great to be on and have a chat with you guys. 

Preston: So, um, we always want to give you the chance to if you have some project you're working on or some, uh, cause you'd like to bring awareness to, [01:10:00] um, the floor is yours to shout out any of any of your things.

Priyanka Patel: Yeah, so I'll try and keep this very short and sweet, but it's quite hard. So, yeah, I'm writing my first fiction book. Um, and when I when I tell you like this. Again, is deep rooted and wanting, I want people, like people that actually to read this book and feel represented, feel seen, laugh, cry, get angry.

Like this, the story centers around, um, a woman called Maya, who is very strongly based on me. It's like me, but in an alternate fiction universe. So everything that happens is complete fiction, but in a monologue, her reaction. Uh, really messed up sense of humor and the way she is so unserious about things is all based on me.

And so, you know, the book starts off, she's lost her 10th job, which is amazing. And then, um, you know, she then, uh, runs into who she thinks is the love of her life. And, [01:11:00] uh, she then finds out something, um, I don't want to spoil it too much, but then, uh, she's basically, uh, then ambushed with a setup afterwards by her parents with the very typical, typical misogynistic Indian man.

And um, she's trying to do that, she's trying to battle a new job. And then there's a lot of things that that kind of happened and throughout the story, it's about describing and showing what it's like living with undiagnosed ADHD. So that's what you see with the main character Maya. So, you know, all that in a monologue, 

Preston: it's a real life clinical experience through a fictional character.

Priyanka Patel: Yeah. So from what I've seen through talking with other women with ADHD from my practice as a pharmacist, from most of the patients I've met with ADHD and from what my. You know, knowledge and understanding of it is as well, and mostly my personal experience. Um, it's to kind of show the real of what ADHD is, because sometimes I feel, sometimes, you know, when we read books and we see those like, [01:12:00] you know, like airy fairy, ditzy, like chatterbox, you know, Oh, I'm a bit forgetful, kind of, you know, that's a stereotype that people kind of associate women with ADHD with.

I don't want that to, to be what people think about women with ADHD. I want people to really understand the messiness of what it's like to have this condition. How, it's, we are so misunderstood, that's what it is. So that's what Maya's story is there to show you it's for all sorts of people if you want to understand what it's like in someone's brain with ADHD because you know her chapters are written in first person it's you know she's so unhinged and it's like you see you literally it's literally like looking into my brain all my in like literally um the thoughts that I have of like you know it's you know when you just walk past a kid and you're just like What if I kicked it?

Just like really, really stupid, like just random thoughts and, you know, all the poor decisions you make and, you know, how you're trying to avoid doing the wrong thing, then you end up doing it [01:13:00] anyway, all the problems you get yourself into. So that's what kind of happens. So 

Preston: you've captured the chaos of this disorder that you've experienced and managed to try to almost package it in this fictional character and allow someone to experience what you've experienced.

Yes. That's really powerful. 

Priyanka Patel: Whilst it is quite a humorous book as well, um, it touches upon some really, like, some serious issues that I think sometimes writers shy away from or sometimes we are quite taboo. So, you know, there will be trigger warnings in the book and, um, you know, we'll touch upon, I don't know if I'm allowed to say on the podcast or something.

Yeah. About that kind of like domestic violence, like sexual assault, suicidal ideation. All things that women with ADHD are more vulnerable to actually experiencing. So, it's about seeing The whole side of when it comes to ADHD and then at the end of the book how she obviously ends up getting her diagnosis and how it leads to that and it weaves [01:14:00] it, weaves in so many elements of like, you know, like comedy and like some hard hitting stuff, romance, there's like a lot of stuff that goes into it and you know, I'm planning for it to be a whole trilogy and stuff, but it's, I've sent the first 10k words to a few people and I still can't believe their reactions.

Like it still feels surreal. Like I'm still writing it and hopefully it'll be finished and I'm going to self publish, I think, because I don't have the patience to go through publishing houses. Um, and plus I'm like, I can't deal with so many rejections. So it's like, you know, I'm just going to do it myself.

But, um, but yeah, it's, um, a very, very personal piece of work. And that 

Margaret: creativity again. 

Preston: Yeah. So, so too much by. Priyanka, you can find her at little miss underscore ADHD on TikTok 

Priyanka Patel: and Instagram. Yes. 

Preston: And do you have a YouTube channel? 

Priyanka Patel: No, I never got around to doing that. 

Preston: Okay. So not, not on YouTube. Well, thank you.

Thanks again so much for joining us, telling us about your interesting work and kind of. [01:15:00] Sharing a little bit of, uh, your world with us as you kind of, um, tell, tell tick tock Instagram and everyone else, like the story of what it's like to have ADHD. 

Priyanka Patel: Yeah, well, thank you so much for having me.

Preston: Thank you so much for listening. How was the show? Let us know what you thought. Um, if you have other ideas for guests that you want us to bring on, and what do you think about the conversation that we have with guests and the direction you want to go? So I know this convo 

Margaret: super included the people listening to this now of like our parasocial relationship with talking about mental health online.

Preston: Yeah. So, if you have any thoughts about it or want to reflect on it with us, come chat with us and our human content family at human content pods. You can find us on IG and TikTok, or you can just contact the team directly at how to be patient pod. com. Thank you to all the listeners that left positive and fun feedback.

Thank you to listeners who. Left negative feedback. It's [01:16:00] you caught me on a good week where I'm actually in a good mood. So everyone is getting thanked regardless of the quality of feedback that you offer. Are you gonna 

Margaret: thank me for your comments on your TikTok? The 

Preston: same cannot be said for next week. If you want to find full videos, find me on our YouTube at It's Presro.

We'll be posting the whole thing with. My facial reactions and the occasional cat cameo as well. 

Margaret: Thanks again for listening. 

Preston: We're your hosts, Preston Roche and Margaret Duncan. You can connect with us on our TikToks where I'm Presro and she is BadArt. BadArt 

Margaret: everyday. 

Preston: Everyday it's art and it's it is bad.

I can verify. Alright. 

Margaret: You're gonna, you're gonna pay for that in your comment section. 

Preston: Our executive producers are me, Preston Roche, Margaret Duncan, Will Flannery, Kristen Flannery, Aaron Corny, Rob Goldman, and Sean Tepra. Our editor and engineer is Tracy Barnett, and our music is by Omer Benzvi. Check out our show notes to see the references and resources we used for discussions in this episode.

To learn more about our program disclaimer and ethics policies, submission verification, licensing terms, and our HIPAA release terms, go to our website how to be How to be [01:17:00] patient pod. com or reach out to us at how to be patient at human dash content. com with any questions or concerns, how to be patient is a human content production.

Thank you for watching. If you want to see more of us, or if you want to see, this is Lilac, she's my cat. She's going to be waving her hand at one of the floating boxes, which will lead to more episodes. Lilac, point to the other episodes. Lilac doesn't know what the internet is, but I swear they're there.

They probably exist for real. But in the meantime, I'm just gonna pet lilac and then I'm gonna go dance in the [01:18:00] background.